October 30, 2002 Work Session with VDOT
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A Worksession between the Frederick County Board of Supervisors and certain staff
members from the Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT) was held on October 30,2002,
at 107 North Kent Street, in the Board of Supervisors' Meeting Room, at 3:00 P.M.
PRESENT
Chairman Richard C. Shickle; Robert M. Sager; Margaret B. Douglas; Sidney A. Reyes;
Gina A. Forrester; and Lynda J. Tyler.
ABSENT
Supervisor W. Harrington Smith, JI. (due to illness).
VDOT STAFF: Robert "Ben" Mannel, Transportation Planner; Resident Engineer Jerry
C. Copp; Transportation Assistant Resident Engineer Ben Lineberry; Ivan Rucker with Federal
Highway Administration and Michael Gray from Roanoke having been their Chief of Transportation,
and their MPO.
Planner Mannel presented an overview of MPO advising of what they refer to as the
foundation of the process, the three C's, continuing, cooperative and comprehensive. He looks at
this as it relates to drawing a comprehensive plan for the County. The process is very similar as a
work program will be set up, this plan in turn will identify tasks and the funds needed to accomplish
this. The work program is done every year, which will be carried out by staff, to be designated by
the MPO. It was decided at the last meeting that the Northern Shenandoah Valley Regional
Commission staff would be the ones that will actually carry out the products under the Unified
Planning Work Program (UPWP). Next would be the Constrained Long Range Transportation Plan,
which is very similar to a comprehensive land use plan, which does have to be updated every three
to five years. If we are a non-attainment area for air quality, it has to be done every three years.
Everything in the plan will not get built, but it has to be in the plan to get built, and this is where the
transportation improvement program comes in. The MPO has to develop a transportation
improvement program every year, as that is basically your programing document, or your capital
improvements. Any type of transportation improvement has to be in the Transportation
Improvement Plan (TIP), and if they are in the TIP it must be in your constrained long range
transportation plan.
Supervisor Tyler asked if her understanding that those roads inside the TIP are earmarked
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Board of Supervisors W orksession with Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT)
on the Metropolitan Planning Organization (MPO) and Rustic Roadways 10/30/02
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for years?
Planner Mannel advised that it was very similar to the VDOT Six Year Plan, the format. It
is a programing document. Funding does have to be identified for the projects.
Resident Engineer Copp asked if an example ofthis would be the Aylor Road project, which
is around Stephens City, and in the County's Six Year Plan.
Planner Mannel advised if it is within the study area, and is part ofthe constrained long range
recommendations, and if you so choose, then it can be in the TIP, and ifit's in the six-year program.
Planner Mannel referred to the Metropolitan Planning Organization and the Policy Committee which
are made up of local officials from the participating jurisdictions, and State Officials, and major
transportation providers, such as bus and rail providers.
Supervisor Sager inquired about these services and the fact that the County does not provide
bus service.
Planner Mannel advised it is up to the MPO Policy Committee and the jurisdictions as to
whom they want to sit on the committee, but unless you have a transient provider, and in this case
an example would be Winchester Transient, and unless they had lines going out to the County, he
wouldn't call it a major transportation service yet. When these lines are extended then you would
probably want someone from the Winchester Transient sitting on the policy committee.
Administrator Riley advised that we have had requests dealing with availability of
transportation to parts of the County.
Planner Mannel addressed the make up of the policy board and those that must be included
in the membership. These would be open meetings that the public is welcome to attend. He further
advised that there are slots for citizens that do not necessarily have a technical background, but are
interested in transportation issues.
Supervisor Tyler asked about the Special Purpose Committee and the fact that she has
discussed this with individuals from other states, especially Wisconsin who has nineteen MPO's.
Under their Special Purpose Committee they have one that deals with land use trying to get
coordination between land use and transportation, which she thinks is a must, for if you have one
you must have the other. She asked if in Virginia this is done with their Special Purpose
Committee? Is this the way to facilitate this?
Minute Book Number 28
Board of Supervisors Worksession with Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT)
on the Metropolitan Planning Organization (MPO) and Rustic Roadways 10/30/02
323
Planner Gray advised that localities select who they want on the Committee. This is what
was done in Roanoke.
Administrator Riley advised as planners for the City and the County they would want this
to be headed to the technical committee to make sure they merit the right way, because if you have
conflicting land use and transportation issues, you are not going to get very far.
Assistant Administrator Tierney advised there was somewhat of a history of going through
this exercise to try and coordinate the land use plan with the transportation plan which was addressed
with the WATTS plan. The formation outline is the third issue which is a check list that has been
set up that needs to be accomplished, and certain dates are attached. He reviewed this schedule with
the Board. May 1, 2003 is the date they are really looking at, at this time. He further advised that
due to the recent census figures, Frederick County and Harrisonburg were added.
Supervisor Tyler stated that one of the reason's VDOT had been asked to come back was
because the City of Winchester had designated their two councilmen and their City Manager. The
County was designated to be Supervisors and the County Administrator. As she understands it, the
population is somewhat balanced because that is a criteria; however, in doing further research, she
finds that some communities have set up their MPO's with their representation based on their
projections. She worries that we are not identifying our study area of our twenty-year progress or
whatever it is.
Planner Gray addressed Supervisor Tyler's concerns advising that in Virginia it is rarely the
case that they are based upon population projections. It is mostly based on the current urbanized
area. With the three C's mentioned earlier, you have the coordination and cooperation aspect of it.
VDOT cannot tell you who is going to be on your policy committee. It is up to you all to work with
the City of Winchester and the fact that it is now being discussed that Stephens City will also be a
member. This will have to be decided among the governing bodies. He advised of other localities
within the State of Virginia that have equal representation.
Mike Kehoe, Town Manager of Stephens City, advised that after speaking with a few ofthe
City's representatives at a recent conference, it was his understanding that they understood Stephens
City was a representative of it's own and not part of Frederick County's three representatives.
Assistant Tierney asked is there a step along the way where the local governing body has an
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Board of Supervisors Worksession with Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT)
on the Metropolitan Planning Organization (MPO) and Rustic Roadways 10/30/02
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approval process over recommendations by the MPO, or is the MPO an independent body made up
of representatives - - -?
Assistant Resident Engineer Lineberry advised ifthe local MPO wanted to have a road built,
but the local governing body was not in favor of having this done, it would be very difficult for this
road to be built.
Supervisor Sager stated that from his understanding of what has been presented and discussed
is, that if the localities do not do something, then VDOT will do it.
Assistant Resident Engineer Lineberry advised if there is a split vote between the
jurisdictions it is very possible that VDOT would be responsible for the deciding vote.
Supervisor Tyler advised that she was not looking to be uncooperative with the City of
Winchester, she is looking to protect Frederick County. The growth is Stephens City, Red Bud, and
we have four supervisors who have urban development areas within their district, and the town.
Administrator Riley asked with the growing population in the County when could we look
at possibly adding additional members.
Planner Gray replied ten years.
Supervisor Forrester asked if the County Six Year Plan has to be married to the MPO and
is there a difference in the funding?
Assistant Engineer Lineberry replied no.
Resident Engineer Copp advised the County would still have a secondary construction
program of approximately $ 3 million. He feels through the MPO the information provided by them
would be more up to date.
Assistant Engineer Lineberry explained about how this would work with non voting members
selected to sit on the MPO such as the Airport Authority, etc.
Supervisor Sager asked ifhaving an MPO within a locality helped to receive Federal Funding
for transportation systems, etc.?
Planner Grey responded that he felt it definitely would give the locality more clout for
planning purposes, especially if a project request is presented before the Commonwealth
Transportation Board from an MPO member of a certain locality. This person would be designated
by the MPO. VDOT is in charge of giving out to the fourteen MPO's within the State. The base has
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Board of Supervisors Worksession with Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT)
on the Metropolitan Planning Organization (MPO) and Rustic Roadways 10/30/02
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been amended since the last meeting from $32,000 to $50,000. This means all localities will start
with a base of$50,000, and depending on the population, additional funds will be going to some of
these localities.
It was noted that these funds could only be changed based on what the President might do,
but are out of reach of the Governor and Legislators.
Planner Mannel advised the next step for the County is to designate their membership for the
MPO and a resolution from the Board recognizing the MPO as the regional transportation program,
and this should be done as soon as possible. The Memorandum of Understanding between the two
jurisdictions also needs to be finalized.
Planner Grey reminded everyone of the work program that is due by May 1,2003. This
would be the work program for what the County would like to see done for next year.
THIS CONCLUDED THE WORKSESSION ON MPO.
The following worksession was held with the Board of Supervisors, staff and Resident
Engineer Jerry Copp and Transportation Assistant Ben Lineberry.
WORKSESSION ON VDOT RURAL RUSTIC ROADWAYS
Resident Engineer Jerry Copp presented this information to the Board. He advised this is
a design Method and is NOT a funding method. He further advised, however, that this provides
opportunities for lower costs and a potential for other sources of revenue. He advised this program
is in accordance with HB659 of the 2002 Virginia General Assembly Session and will become
effective July 1,2003. He outlined the following criteria guidelines:
I. Must be an unpaved road already within the State Secondary System.
2. Must carry at least 50 but no more than 500 vehicles per day.
3. Must be a priority (line item) in an approved Secondary Six-Year Plan, even if funding
is not from Secondary allocations.
4. Governing body of County, in consultation with VDOT's Resident Engineer, must
designate a road or road segment as a Rural Rustic Road.
5. Road must be in area that is low-density, and should be evaluated for appropriate
warning signs or posted speed limit that is consistent with topography and features ofthe
road.
6. Roadway or roadway section must be predominately for local traffic use.
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Board of Supervisors Worksession with Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT)
on the Metropolitan Planning Organization (MPO) and Rustic Roadways 10/30/02
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7. The local nature of the road means that most motorists using the road have traveled it
before and are familiar with its features.
8. County Board of Supervisors will endeavor to limit growth on roads improved under the
Rural Rustic Road program and cooperate with the Department through its
comprehensive planning process to develop lands consistent with rural rustic road
concepts.
9. Requires a special Resolution by County Board of Supervisors for each individual road.
Resident Engineer Copp further explained what was involved with VDOT review and the
approval process. He further explained this is a faster process, but it is not as thorough as the
application that VDOT presently uses.
Assistant Administrator Tierney advised with this plan VDOT would not be obtaining right-
of-ways, due to the way this would be administered.
Resident Engineer Copp advised that he does not feel it will be a cheaper way to go, due to
the way this road application is applied, and with one of the factors being the weather.
Administrator Riley asked how much would the County be able to do with this?
Assistant Engineer Lineberry explained basically the hills, valleys, and curves would be left
the way they currently are.
Assistant Administrator Tierney asked about the rating system and whether it would be used
with this plan?
Supervisor Reyes asked how long one ofthese roads would last with this type of application?
Resident Engineer Copp replied hopefully five to six years. He advised that the cost per mile
using the current application is approximately $160,000, and with this application it would be $500
to $600 per mile. He explained what happened in Shenandoah County with Revenue Sharing. He
further explained in reviewing the current list that he is concerned about the rating system and the
fact that it may hold the County back.
Administrator Riley asked Resident Engineer Copp if he could be prepared at the Board
Meeting of November 11, to advise the Board how many roads within the County would qualify for
Rustic Roads.
Resident Engineer Copp advised that he would have this information available, and further,
he is concerned about this if funding is not available.
THIS CONCLUDED THE WORKSESSION ON RURAL RUSTIC ROADWAYS.
Minute Book Number 28
Board of Supervisors Worksession with Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT)
on the Metropolitan Planning Organization (MPO) and Rustic Roadways 10/30102
327
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Richard C. Shickle
Chairman, Board of Supervisors
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Minutes Prepared By: ~ -r: ~ .Jf~
Carol T. Bayliss
Deputy Clerk, Board of Supervisors
Minute Book Number 28
Board of Supervisors Worksession with Virginia Department of Transportation (VDOT)
on the Metropolitan Planninl: Orl:anization (MPO) and Rustic Roadways 10/30/02