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October 30, 2002 Work Session with School Board 314 A Budget Worksession of the Frederick County Board of Supervisors was held on October 30, 2002, at 2:00 P.M., in the Board of Supervisors' Meeting Room, County Administration Building, 107 North Kent Street, Winchester, Virginia. PRESENT Chairman Richard C. Shickle; Robert M. Sager; Margaret B. Douglas; Sidney A. Reyes; Gina A. Forrester; and Lynda J. Tyler. Members of the County Finance Committee. ABSENT Supervisor W. Harrington Smith, Jr. (due to illness). STAFF Administrator Riley; Assistant Tierney; and Deputy Clerk Bayliss. SCHOOL BOARD Chairman Stuart A. Wolk; Melanie Mullinax; Cary W. Smith; Patricia Stiles; John Lamanna; and Richard Howett. STAFF Superintendent Dr. William Dean and Administrative Assistant Al Orndorff. Chairman Shickle called the worksession to order at which time he turned it over to Dr. Dean. Chairman Wolk advised the School Board would like to discuss with the Board and Finance Committee more about the function of the school system and their culture as opposed to numbers and budget type issues as they have done in the past. He stated that the school system feels they are between a "rock and a hard place." They are expected to, and feel they do, provide an excellent education for the children of this County; however, with ever dwindling funding sources, their job is getting harder and harder. He stated that he feels the governing body is caught even between an even bigger "rock and a hard place." He thanked the Board for all they have done for the School Board, and all they will continue to do. He feels the rock in this scenario is the State financial deficit. He further advised they are in the proccss of preparing for a 5% or $2 million cut in their budget. He feels the results of this being done will be far reaching, and will certainly affect the schools as we all know them. Looking to FY 2004, they have no idea at this time what to expect. He further advised that the funds that come from the State to pay teachers appears to be drying up, Minute Book Number 28 Board of Supervisors Budget Worksession with the School Board 10/30/02 315 or at least decreasing significantly, and ifthis happens they have nowhere else to turn other than to the localities. They realize there are others within the County that also request funding. He stated that as far as the "hard place" local budget issues is the first to come to mind. They have had to do more with less, for many years they are in the mode for digging out. They look to protect their investment and greatest resource, their teachers and staff, yet find their selves fighting to do so with neighboring localities. They have grown by three hundred students this year, and they don't look for that to decrease as building permits and development increase. He further stated that with no new industrial development locating in the County recently, the burden for providing resources falls on the property owners. There are those in the County that are simply not willing to pay higher taxes to provide a quality oflife we have come to expect and enjoy. They are being expected to provide services and achieve results while the expectation of holding the line on a tax increase exists. He does feel this is a realistic expectation. He stated there are those that feel an average school system is okay and is good enough, while the majority of those they come in contact with want and expect more. Because ofthe County's exceptionally low tax rate, we are a magnet for those looking for a great place to live. People can afford a $350,000 house easily, at a tax rate of .61 cents on the dollar. Dr. Dean presented his thoughts on the context in which the schools operate. He advised that the county school system is a transitional school division. He feels the growing population has an expanded expectation for the public schools. It is not just the federal and state mandates, but also the local expectations of excellence and services that go far beyond the mandates that are out there. The context includes for them an evolving leadership role as well. No longer are schools just a place were principals and someone working out of a central office count lunch money and give out supplies. They are re-teaching a culture within their school division based on data provided. They have a very strong focus on instruction, and creating success for students. Their intent, not their wish, as a school division, and done through good planning, is that they will raise district wide performance standards. He further advised that a result focus requires knowing who you are. They would argue that it is impossible to develop a result's orientation, unless as an organization they become clear about their mission, their vision, and about their values. He advised he would discuss this later, as this is their key to success. He advised that in order to achieve their goals, funding is needed. He asked if a "good" school division could become a "great" school division, and they Minute Book Number 28 Board of Supervisors Budget Worksession with the School Board 10/30/02 316 believe with the right people on board and the wrong people gone, and the right people in the right seats, this can happen. At this time he turned this presentation over to Vice Chairman Patricia Stiles. Mrs. Stiles presented the things that the School Board and Board of Supervisors are facing together in this upcoming budget. She advised that the State mandates are being funded from funds intended for their general operating budget at this time as they remain as unfunded mandates from the State. She addressed the current accreditation of the schools and how this has improved over the years. She also advised that their school drop out rate is the lowest of their entire school division history and their SAT scores are the highest of their entire school division history. She explained why the resources are needed to get the right people. She further explained that there is a diminishing pool of qualified applicants from which to chose. She further stated that adequate funds are needed to house county students, not only for today, but also tomorrow. She advised these funds are needed for the opening of Mill brook High School, the fourth middle school, and down the road an eleventh elementary school. She addressed those individuals within the County Administration and those in the community that say we do not need a new middle school. She feels they are incorrect in saying this. She addressed the enrollment figures at this time, and advised there is a dramatic increase in the enrollment. She further advised that currently Virginia ranks thirteenth in the nation in per capita income, but only forty-fourth in state government spending for schools based on the income. She further advised that Virginia ranks forty-ninth in the nation in state aid per pupil in average daily attendance for 2000-2001. She further advised that they want a continuing dialogue between the School Board and the Board of Supervisors. They want to be viewed as partners and not as antagonists and not as the enemy. They truly believe that they are between "a rock and a hard place" and that we are all in this together. Mr. Wolk asked that the Board of Supervisors meet with the School Board in additional sessions to work this out. Mr. Wolk asked the other School Board Members if they cared to comment at this time. There were no additional comments. Supervisor Sager asked where the County currently is concerning teacher salaries, etc. Are we below State average or are we above? Dr. Dean advised this is handled through the Finance Department. Supervisor Sager advised he did not need it today. Minute Book Number 28 Board of Supervisors Budget Worksession with the School Board 10/30/02 317 Dr. Dean stated they would be happy to send it to him. School Finance Director Frye advised that the County is below average, and they would see that Supervisor Sager received this information. Chairman Shickle inquired about VEA and the fact that he used to be on their mailing list years ago. Dr. Dean advised that they do get information from the VEA, they have a composite study of salaries across the State, and he would be happy to put Chairman Shickle on that mailing list. Chairman Shickle asked Dr. Dean where he would suggest that the Board and School Board go from here? Dr. Dean advised that he felt it would be good to continue to have dialogue as this FY04 budget proceeds. He advised that the Board is in a very difficult situation, and their actions are liable to put the School Board in a very difficult situation. As we move through the budget process, it would be their hope that they could have three more meetings with the Board of Supervisors where they could share with the Board specific elements of that budgeting and that resource requirement as they meet with the School Board, and in turn, share it with the Board of Supervisors. Chairman Shickle asked Dr. Dean ifhe could meet with Administrator Riley and go over the calender and come up with some dates. Dr. Dean replied that he thought that would be an excellent suggestion. Dr. Dean advised that the second thing they would like to accomplish today is a commitment for continued conversation, and also clear the air, and get some sense of understanding about the data they use in terms of the need for the fourth middle school. There seems to be a great deal of debate within the community, and some quarters of interest, that the fourth middle school not be built, as their numbers do not reflect it. He further advised that the data presented to the Board, in their packets for this meeting, could be discussed now concerning this middle school if the Board is interested. Administrator Riley advised that the directive has been given to staffto prepare their budgets with a no tax scenario. Dr. Dean advised they are preparing the various scenarios requested ofthem, and they will be provided to the County Administrator. Minute Book Number 28 Board of Supervisors Budget Worksession with the School Board 10/30/02 318 Supervisor Forrester asked if the Board could be supplied with the attrition rates for staff. Supervisor Tyler advised that she looked at that information for last year and she felt it was very helpful. Supervisor Reyes thanked Dr. Dean for the information provided making the Board aware ofthe many accomplishments achieved by the County School System. However, he advised there were two things in Dr. Dean's presentation that he disagreed with. He referred to "growth vs. no growth." He wanted everyone to understand that he is not a "no growther." He is not aware of any of the current Board members that would consider themselves "no growthers." He is for sensible and well-managed growth, and he does not feel that equates to no growth. He stated that he could not agree more with the statement of "between a rock and a hard place." He went on to say that he does feel it is the residential growth in this County that puts the County between "a rock and a hard place." He has been trying to meet with Chairman Wolk to discuss capacity figures concerning the need for the fourth middle school, and hopes to get this done very soon. Vice Chairman Stiles advised that the fact this statement was in their report did not mean they were singling out any Supervisor or even the whole Board. They were saying that this is a sentiment within the County. She further advised that for those that might be wondering where are the budget figures, that by doing their presentation thc way they have, it is their way of starting the dialogue concerning the budget, and it is their responsibility to give the Board the "big picture." Supervisor Tyler referred to information she had received and her meeting with Chairman Wolk. She feels it is important for school administration to review this with the Board of Supervisors, though time is running short. Dr. Dean referred to the chart and the data dealing with enrollment for the current middle schools. Based on this information he feels a fourth middle school was needed in the year 2000, as this is when enrollment exceeded capacity. He reviewed the figures and explained how and what goes into changing these figures when you talk about future enrollment. Supervisor Sager requested that any information that Dr. Wolk would be providing Supervisor Reyes, when they meet, could also be provided to the other Board Members. He inquired when the County would know the exact amount of funding they would be receiving from the State. Dr. Dean replied the earliest they would know would be December 20 - 21, which is only the Minute Book Number 28 Board of Supervisors Budget Worksession with the School Board 10/30/02 '319 Governor's proposal as the final word rests with the General Assembly. He advised that the School Board is expecting a 5% cut oftheir state aid or $2 million cut for the year they are in. They do not expect to see this $2 million coming back to them in FY04. The School Board is anticipating further reductions as the anticipation is that the Governor still faces a $2 billion short fall for FY04. Supervisor Sager asked Dr. Dean if the School Board would be looking to the Board to make up this difference? Dr. Dean advised based on what has been presented and discussed at this session, the Frederick County School System would be a far, far different school division tomorrow than they are today. Administrator Riley advised if the State elects to refinance their debt, the State will be the one to benefit, not the localities. Finance Member Wilkins asked about the possibility of perhaps moving the sixth graders to the elementary schools, as they do have available space, and that would help to hold offthe need to build a fourth middle school. Dr. Dean advised this is a complex issue. Assistant Superintendent ofInstmction Patty Taylor advised that once a student reaches the sixth grade they are considered in II. High and many things change for them. It would not be in the best interest of the student to keep them in the same building with students ranging from kindergarten to the fifth grade. Assistant Superintendent of Administration Bob Cleaver addressed this suggestion from the transportation viewpoint and why he did not feel it would be a good idea. Supervisor Tyler advised based on what Member Wilkins just said, and looking out further for projections, in addition to what Supervisor Reyes has said, with what would happen with a no tax increase, the Board realizes it will be a severe impact to the County. She asked for definite numbers from the School Board on programs, what are the ramifications if the County cannot fund the schools. She feels parents need to know what could be happening to their children. She is very invested in Frederick County Schools. Dr. Dean advised this information would be made available. Chairman W olk thanked the Board of Supervisors for their time. Minute Book Number 28 Board of Supervisors Budget Worksession with the School Board 10/30/02 ------.---'.- -------_._~._~-~-.--- 320 THIS CONCLUDED THE WORKSESSION WITH THE SCHOOL BOARD. ~ cJ::..Y_~ Richard C. Shickle Chairman, Board of Supervisors Minutes Prepared By: t1o"",J--r yy,D~ Carol T. Bayliss t Deputy Clerk, Board of Supervisors Minute Book Number 28 Board of Supervisors Budget Worksession with the School Board 10/30/02