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December 1, 2003 Work Session 248 A Worksession ofthe Frederick County Board of Supervisors and members ofthe Frederick County Fire and Rescue Association was held on December 1, 2003, at 5:00 P.M., in the Board of Supervisors' Meeting Room, County Administration Building, 107 North Kent Street, Winchester, Virginia. PRESENT Chairman Richard C. Shickle; Vice Chairman W. Harrington Smith, II.; Robert M. Sager; Margaret B. Douglas; Sidney A. Reyes; Gina A. Forrester; and Lynda I. Tyler. (Supervisors' Tyler and Reyes were not present at the start of the worksession. CALL TO ORDER Chairman Shickle called the meeting to order. Administrator Riley advised this worksession had been called as a result of a request from the Fire and Rescue Department for a $780,494 supplemental appropriation. The Board held a public hearing on this issue on October 22,2003. Prior to this date Fire and Rescue brought several requests forward, all dealing with Personnel. Those issues were discussed at the County Personnel Committee and subsequently referred to the County Finance Committee with a recommendation to the Board that a public hearing be held on the supplemental appropriation. At the meeting on October 22, the Board authorized positions for Greenwood and Clearbrook and held the rest ofthe funding request in abeyance until the Board had an opportunity to interact with the Fire and Rescue Association. At the November Fire and Rescue Association it was decided that a worksession would be held with the Chiefs and Presidents of each company. He advised that when the Board of Supervisors meet and there are more than two members, it is considered a public meeting. The press is notified and they are present at the meeting. It is not an option as to whether Board Members can meet privately with the Association or the Chiefs and Presidents. This is an open meeting and the directive will be to try and establish dialogue with the Presidents and Chiefs of the respective companies. The Board hopes to be able to get some insight into the concerns with reference to the staffing request. There will be no action taken at this worksession. The action item will be placed back on the Board's agenda for the December 10, Board Meeting. ASSOCIATION PRESIDENT WALT CUNNINGHAM INTRODUCED THE CHIEFS AND PRESIDENTS OF THE ASSOCIATION ADVISING NO ONE WAS PRESENT FROM STEPHENS CITY AT THIS TIME Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103 249 Director DuBrueler advised those present of what had transpired since he made his original request to the County Personnel Committee for the additional personnel. He advised that the department has looked at the immediate needs ofthe department as well as some future needs to be sure they are providing adequate service throughout the County on a 24/7 schedule. He further advised this included the support that comes from his office. At this time he described the duties of his office staff and what he felt their immediate needs were. He further advised of the five positions that were approved at an earlier by the Board with four ofthese assigned to Clearbrook and the other to Greenwood. Chairman Shickle asked Director DuBrueler to further explain "the charge ofthe Board for him to work with the Chiefs to rcduce ovcrtime and bring back to the Board those solutions." He asked if that meeting did take place. Director DuBrueler advised several meetings did take place in order to try and work out the overtime. However, there was no solution to this situation. He advised there is not sufficient staffing in order for overtime to be reduced or eliminated. Chairman Shickle asked Director DuBrueler as to the timing of this request. Director DuBrueler replied they see this as a dire need, given the time involved in hiring the necessary staff that would fill the positions would be six months plus. President Cunningham introduced Chief Locke and President Luttrell from Stephens City Fire Company at this time. Chairman Shickle advised that it would appear to him, as a novice in the Fire and Rescue arena, that over time Frederick County will have to augment the volunteer force with paid professionals, as has been the practice over the past several years. He is currently looki ng for advice from those who know more about it as to how many, when, and what kind, as these are what he needs answers to. He feels in talking with a majority ofthose present they to agree that Frederick County will have to add more career staff. He asked if there was a volunteer that would like to address the issue, of this request, at this time. Is it ready, is it timely, has it been given adequate thinking time, any ofthe topics that Chiefs and Presidents could answer for the Board? President Walt Cunningham read from a prepared statement expressing his thoughts on the volunteer firemen of Frederick County, and what has transpired with them over the years. Hc feels Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103 250 the increase in population within Frederick County has had a large impact on demand for services within the county fire companies. Chief Greg Locke, of Stephens City, advised their biggest concern has been that they have not seen the proposal that was presented to the Board. He referred to the fact that the original 33 positions that were requested and later reduced to 13 was not something his company knew anything about. This is the largest concern that they have, not knowing about what is going on. Don Jackson, Chief of Gainesboro, advised that he feels we need to grow, we need more career help. He agreed with what President Cunningham said earlier about how upsetting it is to read these things in the local paper, it is a big problem and a big concern of many. He further advised of the not knowing about what is going on is a very big concern. He feels it boils down to trust. Director DuBrueler advised there are a lot of rumors that have been circulating concerning this issue. Hans Nydam, President Reynolds Store Volunteer Company, stated that his constituents are looking at paid staff and what is happening now, and we are asking the same taxpayers to put additional funding into the inefficiencies they are currently seeing. Director DuBrueler advised these inefficiencies are due to the lack of proper supervision. President Nydam responded that at one time we must have had something going good. That is their position. They do not want to put more money into something that does not seem to be working. Chairman Shickle asked about the criteria that is used for promotions. Are the volunteer Chiefs and Presidents involved in anyway? Director DuBrueler advised it is based on the Career Development Program that was put into service in October 1998. Chairman Shickle advised that does not give you a feed back on performance. Director DuBrueler stated that part of the criteria for evaluations in the Career Development Program provides a performance evaluation that a person must average four points out of a possible five in an evaluation process, for two years straight. Chairman Shickle asked if a component ofthat also comes from the fire station in which they Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103 251 are stationed. Director DuBrueler advised input is received from the Chief or whoever is designated. President Nydam advised they were told their Chief would be part ofthe evaluation process; however, we understand now that he is not. Director DuBrueler advised their input is part ofthe evaluation, but their Superior is required to do the evaluation, as stated in the County Personnel Policies. Chief Greg Locke advised that he can understand that; however, the supervisor seeing them more on a day to day basis is the volunteer officer. He has been told this officers input maybe considered and it may not. He feels this is the best guidance for their performance. He is concerned how much weight is actually placed on this. Chief Don Jackson asked if everything he writes on an employee evaluation becomes part of his evaluation? Director DuBrueler advised it becomes part of his personnel file. Chief David Plunkett of Round Hill Company addressed the promotions that are being proposed from within the Director's Office. He specifically addresses the six additional field supervisors that are being requested by Director DuBrueler. Director DuBrueler advised the current existing positions were being elevated as they have been in these positions for five years without the chance of promotion and their job duties had more than quadrupled. He feels this is a way to compensate them. He further advised there are only four field officers, one for each shift, and a relief supervisor, a total of six including the two training officers. He further explained what the additional staffs responsibilities would be. He further advised someone would be working at all times. There is supposed to be a supervisor for every four positions and with this additional staffing there would be one for every six staff. Chief Don Jackson addressed the current staffing situation and what is being proposed. He advised what was approved at the Association level. It was approved as Administrative in order for them to get a scheduled structure raise in salary as their career development improved. Director DuBrueler disagreed with Chief Jackson about some having supervisory ability while others do not. He referred to an incident during the past few days and not one volunteer was present, they were all career staff and that was minimum. Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103 252 Deputy Chief Miller of Reynolds Store Volunteer Company questioned the number of new vehicles that were being requested. Director DuBrueler explained on page 19 and 20 the original request for 33 personnel. Page 21 is the downsized request for the fourteen personnel to be done immediately. Deputy Chief Miller of Reynolds Store asked about the population increase within the County since 1990. Chairman Shickle explained the statement was made that there has been a 90% increase in calls since 1990 and he asked what the population increase had been during this time. Administrator Riley advised the population went from approximately 43,000 in 1990 to provisional population of approximately 59,000, round numbers. Larry Oliver advised in 1990 the figure was 45,723, and in July 2003 it was 63,000. Director DuBrueler advised approximately 50%. Deputy Chief Miller asked how much has the Frederick County Fire and Rescue Career Department grown since 1990? In 1990 you had one Fire Marshal, I Director, and six staff. He feels it is fair to say that this department has grown 150%. Director DuBrueler stated probably 200% or more, but he does not think you can equate apples to oranges when you are talking about this as there are other factors that need to be included. Deputy Chief Miller asked Director DuBrueler ifhe did not think 200% was sufficient for now? Director DuBrueler advised, based on the calls that are run every day and knowing the staff that is available, he feels this dictates whether we have the personnel available to serve the public. Chairman Shickle advised he is hearing most ofthe comments on the section "Promotions," with the section "Re-Classification" being next, with the least amount of discussion being "New Hires." Is he hearing correctly? Chief Eddie Keeler, Greenwood Chief asked for clarification on what the new Lieutenants would be doing as well as the ones that are being promoted to Captain. He also asked what the Operations Director would be doing? Director DuBrueler explained in detail the responsibility of each position. Chief Keeler advised that his feelings are, that the system that is currently in place is broken. Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103 253 (Supervisor Tyler left the worksession at this time and returned within the hour.) Administrator Riley asked Chief Keeler ifhe was saying that the volunteers that are present during the evening hours can supervise in lieu of having someone else there. He stated that it is very hard for a Supervisor to do an evaluation of a staff member when they are not present during their shift on a daily basis. Chief Plunkett of Round Hill addressed the 56-hour work week asking if the additional personnel would reduce some ofthese hours. He feels there are other ways for this to work in order to cut down on the overtime that has been a big eon cern for quite some time. Tonya Holliday, Treasurer of Gore Fire Company, asked why the new titles were necessary? Director DuBrueler advised it will allow them- the more responsibility they have the more salary. Tonya Holliday asked, but they have reeeived salary increases? Director DuBrueler explained the only raises they have received is the normal cost ofliving adjustments that every County Employee has received. He stated that other County Employees within the County system that has taken on additional responsibility have received an increase in salary to compensate for that additional responsibility. Tonya Holliday asked if that could not be accomplished by just an increase in salary not necessarily by a new title. Director DuBrueler explained due to how the system works, if you are at the top of your level, you go to your next position in order to be compensated for extra work. Chairman Shickle asked about Fire Company 12 and 15. Why is it that they seem to end up with less staff? Director DuBrueler attempted to explain how this works with the shifting of different employees. Discussion followed with President Nydam and Deputy Chief Larry Oliver as to how the training program was prioritized. There was further discussion with Chief J aekson about the Academy and what has transpired with those who attended classes there over the last two years. Jason Burns with the Frederick County Career Association advised of a recent situation in Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103 254 Brookneill Subdivision with a fire and the fact if more personnel had been there he feels the situation would have turned out differently. He feels there is a severe lack of career personnel. Chairman Shickle asked Director DuBrueler about the overtime that has been on going for some time, and with his additional staffing can we still expect to see $50,000 and over, in overtime, even with this staffing? Director DuBrueler advised if we don't cover our relief positions and we receive additional staffing, yes the overtime is going to go up. Chief Keeler addressed the medics' situation. Dr. Jack Potter, Emergency Room Doctor, Winchester Medical Center, expressed his opinion on what Larry Oliver had said earlier concerning the importance of training and the fact staffhas not been available, as much as they would like to be, due to their scheduling and lack of staff. Chief Don Jackson expressed his views on the great job that is being done by the County Volunteers. He feels the County is receiving an incredible "Bang for their Buck." Dave Whitacre, Chief, Millwood Station, advised he had no problems with the promotions. He does feel there is a retention problem and that our system is not very consistent. Tonya Holliday asked ifthere is any directive in place? Is there a recruitment plan in place for volunteers? Are surrounding areas eausing any of our problems? Director DuBrueler responded. Dr. Bethany Cummings, Lord Fairfax EMS Regional Medical Director, spoke to the way things was back 20 years ago and she feels the people now are not necessarily motivated the way we were back then. The culture is obviously different which is what this meeting is about. She feels someone, an impartial person, needs to be available for when an individual is considering leaving they would be able to talk to in order to explain why certain things are happening. She is not agreeing or disagreeing with the system. Tonya Holliday advised if we constantly look at this as hire more people, hire more people, and don't at sometime address the Volunteer System, which ultimately is and was the core of this system, we need to look at that as well. We need to look at how to get more volunteers and also how to motivate them and get them into the system. Chairman Shickle advised he had some questions that he would like to know the consensus Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103 255 of those present from the fire companies. I. Does the County have too much overtime at this time with career staff? 2. Does the County need to add additional career personnel at this time? 3. Is this request ready to be voted on by the Board at this time? He suggested that a roll call be done of the companies unless someone had a better idea. Ouestion #1 - Is there Currentlv too much Overtime Company 11- Company 12- Company13- Company 14- Company 15- Company 16- Company 17- Company 18- Company 19- Company 20- Company 21- No Yes Yes No No No - (call volume needs to be addressed) No - (needs to be different) Yes - (with objections) No No Yes The majority of the responses were not a clear yes or no as they felt there were certain areas that needed additional comments and just a response of yes or no was not adequate. Question #2 - Does the County Need to Add Additional Career Personnel at this Time Company 11- Company 12- Company 13- Company 14- Company 15- Company 16- Company 17- Company 18- Company 19- Company 20- Company 21- Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes Yes No - not for the hiring of assistance or promotions- feels five positions hired last month are sufficient. Yes Question #3 - Is this packa~e ready to be voted on by the Board of Supervisors at this time Company 11- Company 12- Company 13- Company 14- Company 15- Company 16- Company 17- Company 18- Company 19- Company 20- Company 21- No - with explanations Yes Yes No No No No Yes No No Yes Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103 256 The question of mutual aid was addressed and the overall consensus was that it does need to be addressed. Supervisor Forrester asked the membership if they felt confident that their Company could respond to all constituents 24/7. Company 11- Company 12- Company 13- Company 14- Company 15- Company 16- Company 17- Company 18- Company 19- Company 20- Company 21- Abstained No No Not comfortable with question. Yes Uneasy with question - cannot answer Cannot answer No Yes Yes No Deputy Chief Miller with Reynold s Store advised 80% of their calls are EMS. Chairman Shickle asked Board Members if they were prepared to vote on this issue at the Board Meeting on December 10? Supervisor Tyler stated that she felt this current situation is a huge liability, and she is ready to vote. Supervisor Douglas, yes. Supervisor Smith advised that he was not comfortable with voting at this time as he has concerns and he feels it should not be voted on by the Board until their January meeting. Supervisors Reyes and Sager advised they were ready to vote. Chairman Shickle thanked everyone for attending, he feels it has been very beneficial. He asked ifthere were any additional comments. Deputy Chief Miller advised that he feels the volunteers are getting lost in the system. He further advised that the cooperation that is needed, is not there. Chief Jackson stated that he felt the general consensus is that there are problems between the volunteers and the career staff. He feels there is also a lack of trust and that there is definite need for better communications this has been a problem for a long time, it boils down to trust this needs to be overcome. Something needs to come of this, this needs closure. The coordination that is needed with the Administration is not there. Various statcmcnts madc at this meeting, by the membership, is proof of that. Minute Book Number 29 Board of Supervisors W orksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01/03 257 Chairman Shickle stated that he hopes the membership of the County Fire and Rescue Association knows the Board of Supervisors treats this matter very seriously. The Board wants to make the right decision for the citizens of Frederick County. It would be the desire ofthe Board for a more harmonious opinion to exist and it is their hope that this will improve. He feels things can be made better. The support ofthe Board is there. (TIME: 7:20 P.M.) -- \~ ~S-0 Richard C. Shickle Chairman, Board of Supervisors J~'f( Clerk, Board of Supervisors , , Minutes Prepared By: a 7 ~ ,/ \[)o, , J..-eo <'I / Carol T. Bayliss I Deputy Clerk, Board of Supervisors Minute Book Number 29 Board of' Supervisors Worksession with Fire and Rescue Association 12/01103